220 35558 article Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Hyman Rosen Newsgroups: gmane.comp.lang.c++.isocpp.proposals Subject: Re: Rotational shift operator Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2017 11:46:50 -0500 Lines: 75 Approved: news@gmane.org Message-ID: References: <69593098-e2cc-487e-bd14-9001b27aa7c1@isocpp.org> <5dbc44c6-8186-4fc6-6097-6c9b14b06642@gmail.com> <4958927.u0MoWYMI95@tjmaciei-mobl1> <2fd3948c-9fbf-4b00-b196-da1dba761808@isocpp.org> <98155b5f-67c6-475b-b1fc-368517aa3440@isocpp.org> Reply-To: std-proposals@isocpp.org NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045d58f8603fbd055ef9a775" X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1511801233 11687 195.159.176.226 (27 Nov 2017 16:47:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2017 16:47:13 +0000 (UTC) Cc: zxuiji@gmail.com To: std-proposals@isocpp.org Original-X-From: std-proposals+bncBDKJJPVBQMKRBEED6HIAKGQEW6ASMXA@isocpp.org Mon Nov 27 17:47:07 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: gclcip-std-proposals@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from mail-wr0-f199.google.com ([209.85.128.199]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1eJMYk-0002Xd-6B for gclcip-std-proposals@m.gmane.org; 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[209.85.220.41]) by mx.google.com with SMTPS id n23sor10253435wra.8.2017.11.27.08.47.12 for (Google Transport Security); Mon, 27 Nov 2017 08:47:12 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of hyman.rosen@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.41 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.220.41; X-Received: by 10.223.153.20 with SMTP id x20mr31063994wrb.219.1511801231522; Mon, 27 Nov 2017 08:47:11 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: by 10.28.57.214 with HTTP; Mon, 27 Nov 2017 08:46:50 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <98155b5f-67c6-475b-b1fc-368517aa3440@isocpp.org> X-Original-Sender: hyman.rosen@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=ES499JZJ; spf=pass (google.com: domain of hyman.rosen@gmail.com designates 209.85.220.41 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hyman.rosen@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list std-proposals@isocpp.org; contact std-proposals+owners@isocpp.org List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 399137483710 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.comp.lang.c++.isocpp.proposals:35558 Archived-At: --f403045d58f8603fbd055ef9a775 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 10:12 AM, Nicol Bolas wrote: > > Arbitrarily declaring that people who don't agree with you are a priori > wrong, out-dated, or whatever is not a viable approach for convincing > anyone of the validity of your position. > Then again, there's that Max Planck paraphrased quote, "Science advances one funeral at a time." I think that there is a reasonable possibility that the C++ Standard committee is a victim of epistemic closure - the same people meeting time after time, agreeing with each other on certain priorities that perhaps the C++ community at large would not agree with. Meanwhile, even simple fixes to obvious errors remain unaddressed draft after draft (such as the number of bits required for an enumeration type in [dcl.enum]), while more ways are found to make programs have undefined behavior so that optimizationists can point to the beautiful code their compilers generate by ignoring what the programmers actually wanted their programs to do. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ISO C++ Standard - Future Proposals" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to std-proposals+unsubscribe@isocpp.org. To post to this group, send email to std-proposals@isocpp.org. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/isocpp.org/d/msgid/std-proposals/CAHSYqdaeDaU9P2LChxgLomYa8_d%2BjB2jXRjAStWPjW64VKikEA%40mail.gmail.com. --f403045d58f8603fbd055ef9a775 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On M= on, Nov 27, 2017 at 10:12 AM, Nicol Bolas <jmckesson@gmail.com> wrote:
Arbitrarily declaring that people who don't agree with you are= a priori wrong, out-dated, or whatever is not a viable approach for convin= cing anyone of the validity of your position.
=
Then again, there's that Max Planck paraphrased quote, "Scienc= e advances one funeral at a time."

I think that there is a reas= onable possibility that the C++ Standard committee is a victim of epistemic=
closure - the same people meeting time after time, agreeing with each o= ther on certain priorities that
perhaps the C++ community at large would= not agree with.=C2=A0 Meanwhile, even simple fixes to obvious
errors re= main unaddressed draft after draft (such as the number of bits required for= an enumeration
type in=C2=A0[dcl.enum]), while more ways are found to m= ake programs have undefined behavior so that
optimizationists can point = to the beautiful code their compilers generate by ignoring what the
prog= rammers actually wanted their programs to do.

--
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To view this discussion on the web visit h= ttps://groups.google.com/a/isocpp.org/d/msgid/std-proposals/CAHSYqdaeDaU9P2= LChxgLomYa8_d%2BjB2jXRjAStWPjW64VKikEA%40mail.gmail.com.
--f403045d58f8603fbd055ef9a775-- .