220 26417 <20160626215314.4898895.14852.12884@gmail.com> article Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Tony V E Newsgroups: gmane.comp.lang.c++.isocpp.proposals Subject: Re: iswalpha and locales Date: Sun, 26 Jun 2016 17:53:14 -0400 Lines: 128 Approved: news@gmane.org Message-ID: <20160626215314.4898895.14852.12884@gmail.com> References: <5057e854-b2ea-4c39-81c7-367bc3e54080@isocpp.org> <84d2b9e6-a29b-4c79-8646-2f00dbc5087b@isocpp.org> <1550791.ovymrLsGO4@tjmaciei-mobl1> <020f6a36-3632-4793-9622-96a41ff40aeb@isocpp.org> Reply-To: std-proposals@isocpp.org NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1467007925 28791 80.91.229.3 (27 Jun 2016 06:12:05 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2016 06:12:05 +0000 (UTC) Cc: asorenji@gmail.com To: "asorenji@gmail.com" , ISO C++ Standard - Future Proposals Original-X-From: std-proposals+bncBCUZ5QWKNQIMZHOBXMCRUBDOOO6VU@isocpp.org Sun Jun 26 23:53:18 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: gclcip-std-proposals@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from mail-io0-f197.google.com ([209.85.223.197]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bHHzS-0002xa-8A for gclcip-std-proposals@m.gmane.org; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 23:53:18 +0200 Original-Received: by mail-io0-f197.google.com with SMTP id x68sf329564313ioi.0 for ; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=isocpp-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:date:subject:from :in-reply-to:references:to:cc:x-original-sender :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:x-spam-checked-in-group:list-post:list-help:list-archive :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=7gBQKt8qaKiFrmQcLo6Q8lAUtBknWBqwd/Cfve2decI=; b=HquoKTn9CQ0nKFc0l4+KDqWacDeBgMuBPqtEguJzJGOjmq1Jh6bNMvnaWbibndS+jO RK/pQapgXP1PDs0DpK6klwfDKmnKQrt2NwFd2ueSdalwFsKMyet8rJM13LTeRv9Z+VGp 5mdPWIuFBQ5UGa0n2K3NZCNXIDOtbLfVkgGJ5g/5ggG2y2SKcPRBy00RiF4OfzDpMsJQ eToTIiBsQSg7RZU7yl8+VPNDVUaQ/LwSHXiKyFVro6xBVT25HusTdEa4q39TrCNP+xKV +bIg/UeiRciYgeDXa4iiDFpTuHAscR1I0Acxqxw8b7WwmHP/arePL9CQSUkptsHPuVHA q3lA X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding :message-id:date:subject:from:in-reply-to:references:to:cc :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-spam-checked-in-group:list-post :list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=7gBQKt8qaKiFrmQcLo6Q8lAUtBknWBqwd/Cfve2decI=; b=fpE+3yXqwowy+RrdXmUhPZ11otGw8OdS8trXjSgbYgX5ty/aUqKGultmZl0hlwpPbM xq8VZ07MAVcMn5re9HdMB9wizp5iITpBEDSRP3x9FPydjwrQwWKEymRvSLDjEzel3ThA JmnIlsNLC5QL/s+2Y72rctuNnTnRtI5BQnR0aYgZfjtTHKyDOhMkfennIHf0uObb58xd kc70ZikpfX4y/WLr98RRnez3C8uBhawSjQ73cgIsTXi0XqXWWvEhAcvl4NaaSSDO+j+s WSGU8AIBgs4TuH9zsvPoLTWixJQitl14BLRRZTMeYk2O/YNsS5wDm+wRh7Qv7DmPAElI X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tKzAxRl8sx8FWSX/IoHi6hejd8IzXawuwPCfj/JcyLnHrm91YWH7ZuoJ4zGirElkw== X-Received: by 10.157.11.98 with SMTP id p31mr14570524otd.10.1466977997317; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:17 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: std-proposals@isocpp.org Original-Received: by 10.107.202.1 with SMTP id a1ls650270iog.49.gmail; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.107.30.139 with SMTP id e133mr5442535ioe.35.1466977996408; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:16 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from mail-it0-x235.google.com (mail-it0-x235.google.com. [2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::235]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id n64si1660110itb.52.2016.06.26.14.53.16 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:16 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of tvaneerd@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::235 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::235; Original-Received: by mail-it0-x235.google.com with SMTP id f6so13655678ith.0 for ; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.36.3.145 with SMTP id e139mr6602389ite.40.1466977996217; Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:16 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([24.114.73.64]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p21sm8206497iop.0.2016.06.26.14.53.14 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 26 Jun 2016 14:53:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: BlackBerry Email (10.3.2.2876) In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: tvaneerd@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of tvaneerd@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::235 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=tvaneerd@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list std-proposals@isocpp.org; contact std-proposals+owners@isocpp.org List-ID: X-Spam-Checked-In-Group: std-proposals@isocpp.org X-Google-Group-Id: 399137483710 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.comp.lang.c++.isocpp.proposals:26417 =
=E2=80=8E> If you= happy with minimal  return (c>=3D'a' && c<=3D'z') || (c= >=3D'A' && c<=3D'Z'); implementation,=E2=80=8E...


=E2=80= =8EThat ("of course") doesn't work with EBCDIC. :-)

M= y real point being that none of this stuff is as simple as it seems. And ev= en when we know it's complicated, it is still more complicated than that.&n= bsp;

As suggested by others, if we layer or slice fun= ctionality correctly, we can get close* to 'don't use what you don't pay fo= r', but there is a ton of work to get there.

[*for s= ufficiently large values of 'close']

There is a reaso= n ICU is huge. I hope no one is suggesting we could get all the functionali= ty at 1/10 the price. 
<= br>
=

= = =
Sent&nbs= p;from my BlackBerry portable Babbage Device
= = =
=
From: asorenji@gmail.com
Sent: Sunday, June 26, = 2016 4:42 PM
To: ISO C++ Standard - Future Proposals
=
Reply To: std-proposals@isocpp.org
Cc: asorenj= i@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [std-proposals] iswalpha and loca= les

=D0=B2=D0=BE=D1=81=D0=BA=D1=80=D0=B5=D1=81=D0=B5=D0=BD=D1=8C=D0=B5, 26 = =D0=B8=D1=8E=D0=BD=D1=8F 2016 =D0=B3., 22:51:09 UTC+3 =D0=BF=D0=BE=D0=BB=D1= =8C=D0=B7=D0=BE=D0=B2=D0=B0=D1=82=D0=B5=D0=BB=D1=8C Nicol Bolas =D0=BD=D0= =B0=D0=BF=D0=B8=D1=81=D0=B0=D0=BB:

Why divide it up by Unicode's arbitrary blocks t= o begin with? That makes searching require a lot of conditional branching a= nd cache misses.

Because it's exclude unassi= gned codepoints from table. After this - yes, we can use more complicated c= ompression. But, be price of more complicated and slowly code.

OK, allow m= e to say what I mean a different way. Having that information available at = all is not worth 38KB to most users. The number of people who truly need= to know if a codepoint is an alphabetic character or not is far less t= han the number of people who need, for example, Unicode normalization. Or g= rapheme cluster iteration. And so forth.
I= f you happy with minimal  return (c>=3D'a' && c<=3D'z') = || (c>=3D'A' && c<=3D'Z'); implementation, then just use isal= pha instead. If you need more, this have some price.

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