From -7932676835661836271 X-Google-Thread: f78e5,174aa7b34b06a51 X-Google-Attributes: gidf78e5,public X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit Path: g2news1.google.com!news3.google.com!news2.volia.net!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.vmunix.org!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!stump.algebra.com!devnull From: eldiener_no_spam_here@earthlink.net (Edward Diener No Spam) Newsgroups: comp.std.c++ Subject: Re: Is this really unspecified behavior? Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 04:40:36 GMT Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net Lines: 35 Sender: mail2news@demon.net Approved: fjh@cs.mu.oz.au (Fergus Henderson , moderator of comp.std.c++) Message-ID: References: <1132629737.664847.151630@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> <1132722639.345095.296070@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <200511231401.jANE1BuC092897@horus.isnic.is> NNTP-Posting-Host: news.news.demon.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1132807247 11046 158.152.254.254 (24 Nov 2005 04:40:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2005 04:40:47 +0000 (UTC) X-Robomod: STUMP, ichudov@algebra.com (Igor Chudov) X-User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Greylisting: NO DELAY (Relay+Sender autoqualified); processed by UCSD_GL-v2.1 on mailbox8.ucsd.edu; Wed, 23 November 2005 09:05:19 -0800 (PST) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at cs.mu.OZ.AU X-Path: comp-std-cpp-robomod!not-for-mail X-Received: (from fjh@localhost) by mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.9/Submit) id jAO4ebBk020635; Thu, 24 Nov 2005 15:40:37 +1100 (EST) X-NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2005 09:05:17 PST X-Delivered-To: std-c++@ucar.edu X-Spamscanner: mailbox8.ucsd.edu (v1.6 Aug 4 2005 15:27:38, -2.8/5.0 3.0.4) X-Authentication-Warning: mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU: fjh set sender to devnull@stump.algebra.com using -f X-Newsgroups: comp.std.c++ X-MailScanner: PASSED (v1.2.8 1086 jANH5Irx016136 mailbox8.ucsd.edu) Xref: g2news1.google.com comp.std.c++:2582 Hyman Rosen wrote: > Greg Herlihy wrote: > >> Essentally, the result of evaluating i = v[i++] is unspecified because >> i's value is accessed only once. > > > No, it's undefined in the built-in case, because i is modified > twice in the same expression (by the increment and by the > assignment) without an intervening sequence point. > > Once again, I invite everyone in the newsgroup to notice how > no one understands the rules as they exist. Obviously not true except as hyperbole. > It's asinine not > to have a defined order of evaluation, including side effects. I totally agree with you here. With all due respect to Mr. Stroustrup's printed opinion about the importance of C++ maintaining compatibility with the C language, I also feel that at some time in the future, and I hope it is the near future, C++ should stop trying to maintain compatibility with the C language and do the right things as far as its own C++ language specification is concerned. This is just one of many other areas, which have been mentioned in numerous other posts on these NGs, where compatibility with the C language is holding C++ back from advancing as a language of its own. --- [ comp.std.c++ is moderated. To submit articles, try just posting with ] [ your news-reader. If that fails, use mailto:std-c++@ncar.ucar.edu ] [ --- Please see the FAQ before posting. --- ] [ FAQ: http://www.jamesd.demon.co.uk/csc/faq.html ]